How can I discuss pension income during the dating process?

[00:00:00] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Do you ever wonder how to bring up pension income when you're dating, especially when you find yourself re-entering that dating world later in life? Well, stick around as we dive into a story today about my client named Jeff. Now, Jeff found himself navigating the dating scene in his sixties. So we're going to explore some creative and maybe even some funny ways to tackle those tricky financial conversations. How can you discuss your pension income during the dating process? That's the question we're answering today.

[00:00:33] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Well, let's take a look back at yesterday's show. Now yesterday, we covered the top 7 debt collection scams that you'll want to avoid. And if you miss it, I'm going to highly recommend you go back and check it out. It was truly packed with crucial information to protect yourself from those sneaky scammers. And nobody wants to deal with those sneaky scammers.

[00:00:55] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Well now, let's get to today's listener question. Remember, before I even say the question today, this show is all about answering your question. That's why I call it Ask Ralph. And if you've got a burning question about finances or faith, or somewhere in the middle, just head over to justaskralph.com and submit it. Who knows your question might be featured on a future episode. Well, today's question comes from Bernadette. She writes this.

[00:01:19] Ralph Estep, Jr.: "Dear Ralph, I recently lost my husband of 40 years and I'm considering dating again. I'm worried about how to bring up my pension and financial situation with potential partners. How can I navigate this sensitive topic without seeming too forward or money-focused? Thank you for your advice and for what you do on the show. It's been a blessing during this difficult time."

[00:01:41] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Bernadette, let me start by saying, my heart goes out to you. I've never lost a spouse. I've had many clients who have done it, and I understand it's one of the most difficult things that you go through. So my heart goes out to you and your question is perfect. Listen. Venturing back into the dating world, I'm sure that's kind of daunting. Especially when you're, when you're in your later years, may I say your grayer years. Especially when it comes to discussing your finances. Well this verse, this question reminds me exactly of a powerful verse from the Bible that I'd like to share with you.

[00:02:18] Ralph Estep, Jr.: In the book of Proverbs 19:20, it says, "Listen to advice and accept instruction, that you may gain wisdom in the future." Now, Bernadette, this verse speaks directly to your situation. It talks about seeking advice on how to approach this delicate subject because you're right.

[00:02:37] Ralph Estep, Jr.: You're showing wisdom and foresight because it's not just about money. It's about building a foundation of trust and, more importantly, open communication in any new relationship you might form.

[00:02:51] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Well, now let's talk about my client, Jeff. Now, Jeff found himself in a situation much similar to yours, Bernadette. So this story might give you some ideas on how to approach your situation. Now, Jeff is a 65-year-old guy. Now, picture this. One morning, he's standing in front of his bathroom mirror, getting ready for his date with somebody and practicing. How can I casually mention my pension over dinner? Sounds like the beginning of a joke, I thought, right?

[00:03:17] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Sure. Of course. But that was Jeff. And see, his situation was far from a laughing matter. See, Jeff had been happily married for 42 years. He's been a client of mine for many of those years and I knew his wife well. But then, all of a sudden, his wife developed cancer, and she passed away. And that really hit Jeff hard.

[00:03:36] Ralph Estep, Jr.: It would hit me hard. It hits everybody hard. Like Bernadette, it hit her hard, too. So he spent two years grieving, and he did two years of soul searching. And he finally arrived at this time. He decided it was time to open up his heart and think about the possibility of companionship again. But in Jeff's case, there was really one thing holding him back.

[00:03:54] Ralph Estep, Jr.: And that was Ralph, how do I discuss my financial situation, particularly his pension? You see, because Jeff had worked for the same company for 40 years, and he had a wonderful, substantial pension. And the truth be told, Jeff was comfortable financially. He wasn't a flashy guy, you know, he wasn't running around town, like some kind of big ball, or as they say, he drove a modest car.

[00:04:16] Ralph Estep, Jr.: He lived in the same house that he'd share with his wife. And Jeff enjoys those simple pleasures. Like fishing and woodworking, you know, he wasn't about the flashy stuff. He didn't need what everybody else had. And I remember one time he came in, we were talking about his taxes, and he said, Ralph, he said, listen, "I want to be honest about my finances from the get-go with this dating situation, but I don't want to come across as bragging or, or have someone interested in me just for my money." So he asked me a very difficult question.

[00:04:44] Ralph Estep, Jr.: He said, "Ralph, how do I bring this up without making it awkward?" The truth is, Jeff asked me an excellent question. And I could see the genuine concern in his eyes. Like he wasn't just worried about protecting his assets. Jeff saw the bigger picture. He wanted to build a relationship based on mutual understanding and more important for Jeff is that trust.

[00:05:05] Ralph Estep, Jr.: He built that trust up with his wife, and now he is re-entering the dating realm and he wanted to build that trust with somebody new. So, what do we do? Well, we sat down and devised the plan. Now listen. I am not a counselor. But I often tell people I wear that hat sometimes. Truth is, in my practice, it seems like I wear many hats these days, and maybe that's a topic for another show. So Jeff and I sat down, and we talked about the importance of timing. I think this was a critical point. I said to Jeff, listen. There is no need to bring up detailed financial information on the first few dates.

[00:05:38] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Truth is Jeff, this might not be a long-term relationship. You know, we all go into it with the hopes that it will be. So in other words, what we did was we talked about, look, we're not going to bring it up at first. So, we focused on some natural ways to introduce that topic into a conversation. We talked about how to handle pensions and financial planning in general. And if you missed it, I did a show about a week ago with a financial relationship expert, and I would encourage you to go listen to that because it really talks about some of the same things we're going to talk about today.

[00:06:07] Ralph Estep, Jr.: I'm going to put a link to that in the show notes. So Jeff and I came up with a few, what I call novel creative approaches. And the first one is this. We call it the future plans approach. So I said to Jeff, “Hey, here's what you could do. You could bring up your retirement during discussions about future plans.” Maybe you could say something like I'm thankful my pension allows me to spend my retirement pursuing my hobbies. And he could ask the person he's dating. Do you have any plans for your retirement? I really liked that approach to future plans because it's an easy, novel way to introduce that in a non-threatening or non-boastful way. And then we came up with another one.

[00:06:43] Ralph Estep, Jr.: We called this the volunteer work angle. Now, Jeff was a guided volunteer. Once he had retired, he was involved in his church's financial literacy program. So this was very important to Jeff because he saw how this could impact relationships. So, we came to the idea that he could mention this volunteer work, which would naturally lead to discussions about financial responsibility and planning.

[00:07:04] Ralph Estep, Jr.: I thought that was a great idea. I said, Jeff, that would work. That volunteer work angle would work. We came up with the third one and that's what we call the funny story tactic. Now, Jeff had a crazy story about how he accidentally set off the alarm at his pension office when he went to file some paperwork. He didn't tell me the whole story, but apparently, the fire company ended up being there.

[00:07:24] Ralph Estep, Jr.: The sirens are going off. The lights were flashing. And he said to me, he said, Ralph, that could be a lighthearted way to introduce the topic. And I thought that was a great idea. That funny story tactic. The next one we looked at was number 4. And that's the current events discussion. So we talked; Jeff and I talked about how we could bring up new stories related to retirement or pension issues. And that would open that door to that more personal discussion. And the last one. And this was my idea.

[00:07:50] Ralph Estep, Jr.: I said, “Hey, why don't you call it the grandkid's college fund?” See, I knew this. Jeff was a proud grandfather, and he can naturally bring up how he's been saving for his grandchildren's education. And that very discussion would lead to a broader financial discussion. So Jeff and I wrapped up our meetings and armed with these strategies.

[00:08:09] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Jeff told me after the fact he felt more confident about dating. But he was still waiting for that real test. That real test came when he met Linda. Now, Linda is a 62-year-old retired teacher. And the coolest thing is, you know, once Jeff lost his wife and he went through that grieving process, he always had this love of painting. So he got involved in a local painting class and that's where he met Linda, and he hit it off immediately. They bonded over their love of art.

[00:08:35] Ralph Estep, Jr.: And the thing is Linda had lost her spouse as well. And that was the thing that really brought them together. That experience of losing a spouse really, you know, made them want to get together and talk and they had common experiences and common feelings. And it was a few dates into it. So Jeff took my advice about not doing it right away. He said, Ralph, I'm going to try the funny story tactic. So one night over dinner, it was a quiet atmosphere to have a nice, you know, nice high-end place.

[00:09:01] Ralph Estep, Jr.: They were enjoying each other's company. It was a, you know, kind of a relaxed atmosphere. There wasn't any tension. They had seen each other a couple of times. And Jeff said, you know, the funniest thing happened when I went to the pension office last month. And he launched into that story about setting off the alarm. Now, to his surprise, Linda jumped out laughing. Because guess what?

[00:09:21] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Linda had shared her own story about getting locked in the teacher's lounge on her last day of retirement. The last day before retirement. And what that did was open up a natural, comfortable conversation about their respective retirements and their individual financial situations. And Jeff was able to mention his pension without feeling forced or boastful. And guess what?

[00:09:42] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Linda shared her information about her teacher's pension. What was the outcome? Well, Jeff and Linda discovered that they had similar values. They'd looked at money the same way. They both believe in living within their means. They both believe in saving for the future. And they both had this feeling that they wanted to use their resources to help others. And listen, this was financial compatibility, and it was huge and coupled with their shared interest in the painting and the volunteer stuff, it formed a strong foundation for their relationship. Well, guess what? Two years later, Jeff and Linda got married. And it's funny when they come in and get their taxes done every year; they often joke about their initial awkwardness when discussing their finances.

[00:10:23] Ralph Estep, Jr.: And they are both grateful for that open communication they established. I guess it turned out they were my first real counseling client. So you might ask yourself, Ralph, what can we learn from Jeff's experience? So here are some key takeaways. And the first one is crucial. Timing is everything. You don't want to rush into detailed financial discussions too early in the relationship.

[00:10:43] Ralph Estep, Jr.: It's just not the place for it. Once you build up that rapport and you see that there's chemistry between the two of you, then you use one of the things we talked about. And that leads me to the second thing. Use natural openings. I don't think you should start a date with, well, let me tell you about my pension. Because it's not going to be a positive experience and you might be asking yourself, is this person with me because of what I have? So, use those natural openings in conversation to introduce those financial topics.

[00:11:15] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Another thing that Jeff learned, which was important for him, is that you've got to be honest and transparent. But listen, don't feel like you need to disclose everything at once. You know, that timing, that overtime thing is perfectly acceptable. You know, when I did that interview, I mentioned it, and like I said, I put it in the show notes. We talked about how it may take time to share all those intimate personal financial details. You don't have to do it all at once. It's not like you've got to start this date and, you know, the third date; I better tell her everything I have or tell him everything I have.

[00:11:45] Ralph Estep, Jr.: I don't think that's really a wise thing. Another thing you can do, and Jeff absolutely did this, and that's approach this topic with a sense of humor when appropriate. Because the truth is humor can often help ease that tension. Now, sometimes it's not funny. You meet to have a difficult discussion, or maybe you're out to dinner, and your girlfriend wants to go somewhere really expensive.

[00:12:05] Ralph Estep, Jr.: And you're like, this just rubs me the wrong way. I don't believe in spending money, eating out, or, you know, I'd rather cook something at home, so maybe we can be humorous about it, but sometimes you're going to have to have those difficult discussions. Another thing I would definitely recommend you do is focus on shared values rather than just numbers.

[00:12:24] Ralph Estep, Jr.: See, in Jeff's case, they both believe in being frugal. They both believed in the responsibility to help others. They both believed in living this modest lifestyle so they could focus on those shared values rather than just say, well, how much do you have? Well, how much do you have? Well, how much did you get a month?

[00:12:40] Ralph Estep, Jr.: Well, what does your social security look like? That is not going to be a beneficial conversation. And the last one, remember this. Financial compatibility is an important aspect of a relationship. And I dare say it's even more important later in life once you've got those things established. You know, you've got to realize that financial compatibility is extremely important in a young relationship. But I even say even more in an older relationship, you know, maybe you're not working anymore.

[00:13:10] Ralph Estep, Jr.: You've got this, you know, fixed income for lack of a better term. You've got to have that compatibility. So, Bernadette, I hope Jeff's story has given you some ideas on how to approach your own situation. And remember this, Bernadette. There is truly no one-size-fits-all approach. If you've heard anything I said today, this is the key.

[00:13:29] Ralph Estep, Jr.: The key is to be honest; the key is to be respectful and be true to your values. So, let's do a quick recap of what we cover. We discussed the importance of open communication. That was the key. And that open communication is extremely important when you're talking about finances in relationships. And like I said, especially when you're dating later in life, that happens a lot.

[00:13:50] Ralph Estep, Jr.: So we looked at some creative ways to bring up pension income and financial situation. We talked about using humor. We talked about, you know, making those plans for the future, like, you know, I'm going to help my grandchildren go to college. Most importantly, we talked about those natural openings that can open the door in conversations. Remember, the goal is to establish trust and understanding. It's not to impress or overwhelm somebody. If you're looking for that, you are in the wrong mindset.

[00:14:19] Ralph Estep, Jr.: You're in the wrong paradigm for dating. Now, you may have listened to this, but you're struggling. You're thinking, Ralph, how can I do these financial conversations? Maybe you're already married. You're like, how can I do this? How can I make this work in my relationships? Maybe you need help managing your finances in general. We live in difficult economic times, and I see people hurting.

[00:14:37] Ralph Estep, Jr.: I see them every day. Well, guess what? I'm here to help you. This is what I do. This is what my calling is in life. You can schedule an appointment with me by going to askralph.com. Click on the banner at the top. You'll see it says to book a call with Ralph. I've been helping people just like you. Yes. You since 1994. It's been a long time and it's been a labor of love for me. And I'm certain we can work together to help you achieve financial success. Maybe that's navigating retirement planning. Maybe it's helping to build your business or looking for ways to do better with your financial management. And I couple all of this with that Christian approach. You don't hear that much out there in the secular world.

[00:15:20] Ralph Estep, Jr.: And I do charge a $150 consultation fee because I can't work for free. But here's the thing I'm going to guarantee you. I will guarantee you this. You will gain at least the value of that consultation that cost in concrete savings. If you don't, guess what? I'm going to refund your money to you. Because I know together.

[00:15:40] Ralph Estep, Jr.: I want to work with you to improve your personal finances. I want to help you grow your business. I want to help you categorize things and get your taxes right, all with the idea of helping you achieve all your financial goals. So why don't you schedule today and let me create a personalized plan just for you? Now, before we wrap up, I want to remind you about tomorrow's show. Tomorrow, we'll be getting on to Thursday's tax talk. And that will be this question.

[00:16:05] Ralph Estep, Jr.: What steps can I take to avoid a tax time bomb in retirement? Nobody wants a tax time bomb. So that's a show you don't want to miss. Remember this. My passion is to help you achieve financial success. That's why I do what I do. That's why the Ask Ralph show exists. I want to see you live out your dreams.

[00:16:24] Ralph Estep, Jr.: I want to see you grow in your faith. This is my mission field. And guess what? The field is right with people who need help. And I know together we can master your finances from that Christian perspective. There are Christian answers to your financial woes, so let me help you find them. And let me help you put those together so that you can find those success points and live out your dreams.

[00:16:48] Ralph Estep, Jr.: And as I always say, stay financially savvy and God bless you.