Navigating Real Estate - A Discussion with Gina McCollum Crowder

EP 55 - Navigating Real Estate: An In-depth Discussion with Gina Crowder

 [00:00:00]

Welcome

back to another episode of the Ask Ralph podcast. Today we have a very special interview lined up for you, but before we get started, let me ask you a question. Have you ever wondered how can you make the most of your real estate investments or how about this? How do you buy or sell property in a way that maximizes your financial gains?

Well, today we're going to shed some light on that. We have the pleasure of speaking with the incredibly talented friend of mine who's done many transactions for me. Realtor Gina McCollum Crowder. Welcome Gina.

Thanks Ralph. Thanks for having me. [00:01:00] Oh, you're welcome. I appreciate you taking the time to join us.

You know, you have an impressive track record in the real estate industry. Helping countless individuals and families achieve their real estate goals. How about you share with us some key strategies that have contributed to your success?

Absolutely.

 One of the most important strategies that I personally find is to understand the needs of my clients.

Every single individual and family has unique goals when it comes to real estate. So you have to be an active listener, ask the proper questions. I tailor my approach to best meet their needs. This personalized approach not only helps me establish trust and rapport, but it also allows me to provide customized solutions that truly benefit my clients.

So I would assume that the biggest transaction you deal with is when someone is looking to buy a home. Imagine that's the biggest one.

 So now what advice can you give for our listeners who are thinking about purchasing our, purchasing a property, their first house, like [00:02:00] what's the best advice you can give them?

Well, let's just start by saying it's a significant decision and it's very important to approach it with careful consideration. My advice. would be to start by clearly defining your needs and priorities. For example, you would consider your location, the size of home you want, features you're looking for.

The most important thing is to get pre approved for a mortgage before beginning this search. This step not only helps you determine your budget, but it also positions you as a serious buyer in the eyes of the seller. Finally, you should seek guidance of a realtor who can navigate the complex. process and negotiate on your behalf.

Gotcha.

 I did a podcast a week or so ago on, making that dream a reality, the first time home buyer. So now, in what you're seeing in the market right now, do you feel like it's harder to buy a home right now, or do you think it's a little bit [00:03:00] easier? what's your impression of where we are right now?

Right now the inventory is slim, so there are a lot of multiple offers. That are happening. the inventory I believe will pick up once interest rates, come back to what people perceive as being normal, even though this is kind of normal. What we saw before was not.

Do you think interest rates are going to come down, Gina?

Do you think we've gotten to a point where we've hit the top and now we're on a downward trend or do you think they're going to go back up or what do you think they're going to do?

I'll tell you what, Ralph, I actually sat on a call the other day, and what they are saying, or at least eight large indicating firms are suggesting and these indicating firms are Goldman Sachs. MBA, Zillow, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, the Home Price Expectation Survey, NAR, Realtor. com. They personally anticipate a 5 percent appreciation in home value and, they believe that the interest rates [00:04:00] are going to probably, slide towards six by the end of 2024.

Really? Now, see, I had Jason Bachniak on the program.

I think you know Jason. He's a mortgage broker. Yes, I do. I had him on a couple weeks ago, and he and I had a long discussion about this, and he actually takes a different approach. He thinks after the presidential election, we might see double digit mortgage interest rates. Do you think that's a possibility?

Well, I think, Ralph, I think it's going to depend on who gets in.

 Well, I think that's a very good point. Yeah, because I almost feel like right now things are being propped up to, support the person that's in there now, there's not a whole lot of fundamentals in the market. And the thing is, Jason, I talked about this.

Back in 1979, a very similar circumstance to where we are now, and, you and I were younger back then, obviously, but interest rates on homes were 14, 15, 16%. What do you think that's going to do for the average buyer you work with if we see interest rates go to that rate again?

Well, that, at the prices we're at, that'll eliminate any [00:05:00] buyer, quite frankly.

 if it goes to that, at these prices, especially with inflation, the way it's going. but I am, I'm a positive thinker, Ralph. So I'm hoping that, the political arena. Lends its hand to allowing this to happen and allowing the market to be a little bit more normal where the interest rates do slide down and sellers feel they could put their house on the market and purchase something else, because that's the problem.

They feel like they're locked into this 3 percent interest rate and the housing prices are up and so are the interest rates and if they don't have a true impetus, a death, a divorce. A relocation. They're just not putting their homes on the market

Yeah, and I meet with clients every day and they make a comment to me like, ralph We really thought about buying a new home but doggone at our interest rates three percent doesn't make a lot of sense for us to go buy something and what I'm seeing in the market and [00:06:00] clients are telling me is that they feel like prices are really still overvalued.

Would you tend to agree with that? absolutely. Yeah. And that makes it tough because then I guess when you're dealing with, cause you really deal with two different distinct people, I would assume, you deal with the buyers and the sellers. Let me ask you this question.

Which one do you prefer to deal with more?

I actually like to deal with both, a seller and a purchaser, to be honest with you. they all have different needs and it's great to work with both

Do you feel like your role is more of that of a coach these days, like trying to coach through the beginning to the end of the process?

100%.

100%.

Yeah, and that puts you in a difficult spot, I imagine. what are the frustration points you see?

Well, the frustration and obstacles are, a lot of people are waiting for prices to drop. They're saying they're unable to, put down their down payment and, their credit scores are going down because they're forced to take a lot of credit cards right [00:07:00] now to pay their bills.

Are you seeing the underwriting process being more difficult now as well? I do because the truth of the matter is I guess when you got into this did you really expect that you'd be doing as much credit counseling and coaching and Underwriting assistance or did you really feel like your job was going to be more, you know Buying and selling homes and now you've kind of taken a role of being a coach and a underwriting assistant

Well, I think i've always had an interest in the financial aspect of things because I was a margin trader prior to doing real estate So I've always, watched the market and, and enjoyed that part of.

Of real estate. but yeah, it's becoming a little bit more difficult for sure

Yeah, and the thing is I think you and I both would agree A person's home is generally their largest asset and their largest investment I mentioned this in my book mastering your finances, which you can get at our website That's askralphpodcast.com/store. You [00:08:00] pick up my book right there a shameless plug for my book But one of the things I mentioned in there is that you really have to go in this with your eyes wide open this is a 30 year commitment and I think people don't realize just how big a deal that is. Do you find that with your new buyers, they just don't get like how significant this commitment is?

 I'll tell you what they don't understand that.

I think that we need to educate them to understand is that homeownership promotes wealth and that homeowners, children of homeowners, quite frankly, children of homeowners entering homeownership earlier. and I have to say that the relationship to, tap equity, for example, and business owners and to help with retirement needs.

 quite frankly, the median net housing value increased 44 percent between 2019 and 2022. Wow. That's a big jump. According to the Federal Reserve Board. Yeah. Yeah. and a homeowner's net [00:09:00] worth right now. Is around 396, 200 as opposed to a renter's net worth of 10, 400. And that's a huge gap. the, fact of the matter is the earlier that you jump into homeownership, the more wealth you accumulate.

And I think that's important to know because even in 2010, when we were dealing with the economic downturn in real estate, the gap of those folks net worth. Even in 2010, when we had the economic downturn in real estate was 187, 000 compared to 5, 400 for a renter.

Wow. That's a huge difference. So if I've got a client that's thinking about selling their home,

you know, that's a difficult decision to make.

Like, what are some things they could do to be prepared for that? I'm sure you walk into some houses sometimes when you're looking at being the listing agent and you just Kind of close your eyes and pretend like you'd never walk through the door. I imagine That's true. Yeah, I mean I imagine [00:10:00]that's got to be an interesting situation So what can my listeners who are thinking about putting their house on the market do to be prepared for that?

sure, it's a hard conversation to have as you say with some of the sellers for sure, but let's face it curb appeal to your property is absolutely essential, making small improvements, even to the exterior, maintaining your landscaping, ensuring that you have a welcoming entrance, it just sets a positive first impression for the buyers, staging a home naturally that makes a difference.

Decluttering, organizing, arranging your furniture and decor. it all just gives a vision. It gives the buyer a vision to imagine them living in your space.

 Yeah, the truth is, I imagine your view of what looks good in Decor and what someone else's looks like is probably a heck of a lot different.

Tell me about a horror story you've ever had going into a house you were getting ready to list.

Oh, gosh, I've been through many. I've been through hoarder houses. [00:11:00] I've been through. Oh, I bet that's interesting. Oh, it's quite interesting with a mouse running across your feet. Sure. I've been through, houses with many cats that we've had to get, the smell of many, many cats out of the home, things like that.

 but we get through it. I mean, I've been there, I know how to educate them, and I have people that I work with, and it gets done.

Yeah, because even paint colors, I'm imagining you're going into places sometimes, and I remember as a kid, there was a house up the street from us, and I remember walking through to my friend lived there, and they had Pepto Bismol pink walls in some of the rooms.

And I said to myself, wow, if you ever go to resell this thing, how in the world would you do that? Do you still encounter that some today? Yeah,

on occasion we actually do, sure. and some people actually really love their colors and it's hard to explain to them that this is just not what the buyer is looking for right now.

So, let me help you to [00:12:00] maximize your return on

investment.

 Yeah, and that's gotta be tough to have those conversations because now do you find that most people's homes are cluttered?

 I would say it's probably 75%, yes.

Yeah. And so how do you broach that conversation, Gina, when you go to meet with a potential listing customer?

Like, how do you broach that conversation? you want to have a good first impression, so you don't want to walk in with being negative. But I imagine at some point you got to say to them, listen, you got some work to do here. Like, how do you handle that?

I think now with HGTV and all of the people watching HGTV.

To be honest with you, the conversation is a little easier than it was in the past. So they're a little open to suggestions and following the lead that you give them.

 You started talking about pricing.

So let's take a couple minutes and talk about pricing because I know when I've sold homes in the past and you've represented me on a couple of those.

 as the seller, I want to get the maximum amount, but I [00:13:00] think that sometimes my view of the value of the property and the real value are two different things. How do you handle those situations?

Sure. Pricing, you have to be competitive. It's crucial to be competitive in order to maximize your investment, maximize your return on investment.

Quite frankly, if it sits too long, you're going to get a lower price at the end of the day. So you're better off pricing it a little under market.

Do you feel like there's a magic number of that? I know when, I don't even know if you still have these, the multi list books or the multi list online.

I know you used to target like how many days before it becomes kind of, oh boy, you're in trouble. Is there still like a magic number to that, Gina?

Well, the magic number used to be 30 days, to make an adjustment. right now I have to say it's a little less than that because The market's pretty quick.

And that's because of the fact that we have very low inventory. I've had clients say to me that it's so bad right now. It's not a question of going to find a house they want. It's going to find a house [00:14:00]they can find. That's correct. That's still the case now?

Yes, that is the case. And what I have to do for my buyers, and I'll tell you what I do, I've been working very, very hard for them, I've been telling them, look, find a neighborhood that you like.

I've been writing letters to the neighborhood and I've been saying, look, Christina and John, they want to find a house in your neighborhood specifically. So if you are contemplating a move, please call me and I'll make the whole process a lot better. and they're willing to wait for you to find a home.

That's

pretty much what we've got. You've got to do a lot more like scouting work now, you're out scouting the neighborhoods looking for anybody. I guess you do your drive by and if somebody's out in their driveway, Hey, you want to sell your house?

I haven't done that yet actually, but I will send the letters and I'll tell you, I have them scouring neighborhoods.

I said, you drive by, and if you really love the way a house looks from the outside, give me the address. [00:15:00] And I've been dropping them a letter once a month. And believe it or not, I sold a house. I've sold a few houses like that, but. One in particular last year in Harrogate that really stands out to me.

 my folks were downsizing from a larger house in Landenburg and they wanted to stay in that location and Harrogate was what they wanted, but they only wanted two streets, either Hyde park or Crescent and. And we finally got them what they wanted, so it was a win.

Yeah, it's got to be tough from the buyer perspective if you think about it.

Right now, interest rates aren't great. You can't really find the house you want, but what do you do? It's you're kind of stuck. do you see some people just saying, I'm just going to bite the bullet and rent for a while? is that an option now? Do you think that's a wise option right now?

Well, it is definitely not a wise option. I to own a home and to purchase it's the dollar, is always going to be stronger, to purchase now than it is [00:16:00] later. Let's, let's be honest. appreciation is going to happen with housing. and it's going to continue that way. if you look at history and history shows that.

Again, I just told you that a homeowner net worth right now is 396, 200 on average, as opposed to a renter, which is 10, 400. So clearly owning a home is the accumulation of wealth. but yes, it's hard. It's hard to tell people that you should bite the bullet now and, pay a little bit more.

Pay the interest rate and you can refinance later and really explain all these things to them

 So I know you have told me before and i've had several other real estate clients that they have these things called deal savers Let's talk about some of those what have been some of your more interesting deal savers things You had to do at the last minute to make this deal happen

let's see [00:17:00] I've had to provide home warranties i've had to remove wood From the outside of a home because someone said they weren't going to keep the Woodburn fireplace, they were gonna transfer it to gas,

and they wanted

So,

Gina, hold on a second. are you donning a pair of bib overall? Are you heading out there and actually moving wood yourself?

 Oh, no, no, no, I'm not. I'm paying somebody to do it. But yeah, I've done, I've done things though. I've helped people move, furniture and some items out of the house last minute.

Sure. Yeah. I've gotten my hands dirty a few times.

Yeah, I imagine so. and I even know, I remember some, some situations with deals we've had, they got kind of crazy, but, so what do you think have been the biggest underwriting obstacles that you've seen as of late?

The underwriting obstacles, I would say, have been appraisals, not matching up to, purchase prices.

Let's talk about that for a second because I think that's a really important concept to think about because I have [00:18:00] heard from clients, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, that even though we're sort of in a bidding war pushing the prices up, the appraisers seem to be a little tight and a little cheap on their appraisals.

Have you seen that to be the case?

Absolutely, because people are having to pay quite a bit more. then the comps prove for value.

So what do you do in that case? let's pretend, I'm going to go buy this house and let's just use a simple example. It's a 300, 000 house. And I, Oh, this house is, I got to have this house.

And you write the sales contract for 300, 000, you have the appraisal done and it comes in at 275. Now, what do you do?

A lot of people are paying the gap. They're paying the difference.

 Well, that's kind of tough if this is your first house and you've saved up 10 percent for your down payment and all of a sudden, when you got to get to the settlement table, you got to come up with another 25k.

I imagine that's causing a lot of deals to drop through. Yeah, absolutely. And is there anything that you've found that you can do to kind of shove the appraiser a little bit or are they kind of stuck in the mud?

 [00:19:00] Well, I will tell you that I feel it's critical as a listing agent to actually show up for the appraisal and point out the, upgrades to the home.

And a lot of times that does make a little bit of a difference.

Do you ever recommend to your sellers actually getting an appraisal done prior to listing it sort of as a, Hey, here's what we really can prove. do you find that to be something you recommend?

I do not because it's subjective. And quite honestly, Appraisers are human.

Right. And what someone values, and how people read. We're not computers. So when we are looking at houses for comparisons, how they value each house is different in their minds and how they lend a little extra to each upgrade.

And let's talk about that for a minute because you and I pretty much understand the whole thing about comps, but most people that, buy one or two homes in their life don't necessarily understand comps.

Can you shed some light on [00:20:00] what, what you're talking about there when you say comps?

Sure. An appraiser is going to look at, within the last, 90 days and a two mile radius, the homes that sold, and then they're going to use those homes that sold and have settled. As comparisons to the home that you're purchasing and that's how they place the value on the home.

That's got to be tough Let's say I'm looking at selling my house in a development and I'm the guy on the block that's done all the exterior maintenance. I'm the guy that's done all the upgrades and all that stuff, but I'm sort of stuck with what does this market or what does this neighborhood bring, right?

I mean, that's the truth.

I'll tell you what, in, in my neighborhood, I'm at the Hunt at Louiviers, and now there, there's quite a disparity. So, I think that the appraisers are coming around in that space, knowing how much things cost to improve, and are giving more value than they [00:21:00] used to upgrade.

 I will give them that, for sure, because there's disparity in a lot of the development.

So let's talk about that. So if I'm thinking about selling my home or just in general, making investments in my home, what are some things that turn out to be winners both, I'm going to enjoy them while I'm there, but also really turn out to be good winners from the appraisal perspective?

 what are some things I can put money into that you see really pay off in the end? I will tell you,

 bathrooms. kitchens. Those, the kitchen and bathrooms are the big heavy hitters.

 And I've always been told that swimming pools are a negative. Is that still true? No,

not even. No, because after the COVID

situation.

Oh, okay. I guess things have changed on the COVID. Absolutely.

A lot of people are seeking out pools. And are paying extra for them and quite honestly To build a pool right now is very expensive and you have to be on a waiting list of about two

years And my wife and I [00:22:00] went through that I guess it was I think it was summer last summer we happen to luck out but you're talking about the cost the inflationary Yeah, pressure's on the building of a pool, I just, it was stupid money at some point.

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely.

So, along those same lines, what are some things you would say people don't do, like some definite do not dos if you're thinking about selling your house? Things

not to do.

The things that you've seen and you're like, oh my gosh, this is never going to sell like this is a disaster This is a real big problem.

I'll give you an example of one I had a client that renovated their basement and when they did that renovation they failed to put any kind of egress in and what I mean by that is a A way to leave the basement, except for through the house.

Oh sure

How about some do you know of any others that like jump off the top and you're like, you know, don't do this

 Well, I usually, to be honest with you, have them go through me if they're going to [00:23:00] do any improvements, and I tell them what is, a worthy investment, what you're going to get money back for, or what is not worth doing.

 if I walk into a situation, where, there's just shoddy workmanship, to something that the homeowner did themselves, or that they, they have code violations and things like that. Then I'm just going to tell them right off the bat and tell them that this pricing is going to be affected.

 you're going to have to put it a little extra competitive for those reasons.

So in a perfect world, and I'm thinking about selling my house, what's the lead time you would really like to start the process with me? I may not want to list it right away, but what is a good lead time of to give you enough time to really do your job effectively?

 I would say a month, you know, three weeks is really good. this way they can get what they need done. painting, cleaning, decluttering, things like that.

I imagine that's, and staging, I guess, is a big deal these days too, right?

Yes. [00:24:00] Staging is, although you could do it virtually as well, but yes.

Oh, let's talk about that. That's pretty cool. So you've seen some virtual staging now. Let's talk about that. Yeah,

virtual staging, a lot of AI is coming down, which is the artificial intelligence allowing, for staging and a lot of different things, Ralph, a lot of different things.

Well, that's pretty cool.

Let's switch our gears a little bit and talk about those who are thinking about, doing real estate investments to grow wealth. Do you do you work with those kinds of folks as well? Absolutely. Yeah. So what advice do you have for them? Because they're not really as keen about worrying about like this is their dream home, but they're more real estate investors.

 what are some tips you have for them?

 For them? I always say, location, rental income, and property appreciation. A lot of people are just concerned with, the rental income, but property appreciation and location are key factors. I tell them that, you need to. Know what you're looking at in a home.

A property inspection might be worthy. even if you're spending the money and not [00:25:00] asking for repairs. Just to see if there's, things that are hidden. Such as termites and structural damage and things like that and crawl spaces and what have you.

Do you see value in those home inspections? I have to be blunt with you.

 I've had them done a few times and to me they almost seem like a complete waste of money. What's your thought?

I would say that the inspector that I use, very regularly, is fantastic. And they have found things that I personally wouldn't find because I will go in the attic space, Ralph, if I can stand up in there and, look around and walk around a little, but I will not go in a crawl space underneath the ground with vermin and things like

that.

I don't think anybody wants to do that. I hear that no

No, so I have to tell you I have my inspector is good and has found things that really changed the course [00:26:00] Of the purchase.

Well, that's a good thing. So it sounds like overall advice. You're saying conduct extensive research. you're saying that to anybody who wants to get involved in real estate investment, they have to look at the long term financial implications because it's not as simple decision as what you're saying.

It is

not, you have to look at the whole picture of what's your goal is it short term? Is it long term, how things trend in the area, things like that.

Are you seeing, fewer people doing flips these days that are just buying a property and trying to flip it to make a couple bucks?

I think that the people that are out there that, that flip know what they're doing, and they have a contractor base already. But if you are a first time homebuyer, looking to improve a home, and what have you, the cost of the materials and the labor and finding the people to come to the house is challenging.

Yeah, I agree with you. I've got some clients that, they said to me over the years, we listened to this online thing and, [00:27:00] I'm going to be a real estate investor and I'm going to go do this. And it cracks me up because they have no concept of what, no, it's true.

They have no concept of what they're getting into. They don't understand that you're going to go hire a contractor that's probably not going to show up. First, unfortunately, they're going to, you're going to over promise and under deliver. Yeah. The only time I've seen that really affect is if I have a client that really is hands on, and is good with tools.

I mean, then it might work. I kind of hear you saying the same thing.

That's exactly right. I would definitely agree emphatically with that. I mean, even to do a bathroom, It's quite expensive. I've

had clients spend 50, 000, 60, 000 on bathrooms and I go, what in the world did you put in there?

Nothing. 40, 000 to do a standard bathroom, yeah. A decent sized bathroom, yeah.

Yeah. Excellent.

Well, Gina, I want to thank you again for joining us today. That was very helpful and insightful, for more real estate tips and resources, you can visit us at our [00:28:00] askralpodcast. com and we'll have show notes there in those show notes.

I'll have information of how to get in touch with Gina so that you can, work with her. If you feel like that'd be a good connection for you and remember this, your financial success is within reach. You just have to make sure you find the right people to partner with. So Gina, thank you for joining us today.

Do you have any final thoughts before we go?

I'd just like to say, Ralph, I think it's great that you're doing this and educating the public with, finances. And I think it's really important for them to be educated in this space. So it's been a pleasure.

I appreciate it. I agree. And I, and I try to encourage clients to, if they're thinking about buying a home, Come and meet with somebody like myself, sit down, pay me for a consultation because this is probably the largest investment you're going to make and you have to understand what you're getting into.

It's not as simple as, signing a couple of papers and here you go. I mean, there are so many things related to this, taxes, repairs and maintenance, all those types of things. And people just don't have any concept of that and they just dive right into it [00:29:00] without really doing their homework.

Absolutely. Budgeting is huge and people need help in that

space. Amen. Preaching to the choir there. Well, thank you for listening. God bless you. And as I always say, stay financially savvy folks, have a good day.